RGBW Flood driver question

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Razzle69

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I would like to build some RGBWW floods for wall wash on my house. Since i want to use them year round i am going with a 12w RGBWW LED from Aliexpress. These are from the Hot Red store: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803441811961.html

I was going to use @RobG PixelFlood boards to control each LED, but i just realized that the PixelFlood boards are only RGB and not RGBW. Am i wrong? Is there a board similar to RobG's that can control RGBW or is there a mod for the PixelFlood that i can do that will allow 4 channel control?

I am a n00b when it comes to christmas shows but i have a theatrical lighting background (former professor and theatrical lighting system designer) and am a maker/hobbyist in my spare time. IT Infrastructure engineer by day. So i know my way around Ethernet, DMX, EDMX, power etc. But i am NOT an electrical engineer. i can drive a soldering iron and put together boards, even do some modest troubleshooting and repair, but i do not have the skillset to modify or design circuits. So i am asking for suggestions. I will be doing some more searching in the forums and the wiki but i figured that asking the community might be faster.

Thank you for all the knowledge and wisdom available here. This has opened up a whole new world for me. Both good and bad. :biggrin:
 
Th chips are different RGB is 3 colors red green blue.
RGBW is red green blue white
THE RGB can make a mix of all 3 colors witch looks white
The RGBW has its own independent pure white chip witch looks nice and white.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
 
Yeah, I wanted the rgbw because I would use the white on the house the rest of the year when we didn't have holiday lights up. I am currently exploring a diy DMX to rgbw board. I was hoping somebody could suggest something else. I did read here that I could just use the pixel flood and treat the white separately. That would mean another controller in the box. not sure how I feel about that idea yet.
 
A long time ago I designed and built a 6-channel board for driving dumb RGB strings, intending to play around with dimming curves to see if I could attain fairly linear appearances. The input was using the Renard protocol, but changing that to accept DMX input is fairly easy. The design is fairly clunky by comparison with the RobG design (just under 3"x3", all through-hole), and would require external current limit resistors (easy to do with a barrier strip).

I'm not sure that I want to do anything with it now, as I suspect that other people will come up with better solutions (it wouldn't surprise me if Dirknerkle has something in a cabinet in his garage).
 

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To your specific question, the Robg boards are 3 channel boards. I don't know of another board in our community that is 4 channel without going to a renard/DMX style board. I wouldn't be surprised if someone out there hasn't created a 4 channel board that supports a flood enclosure but I don't know where it is.

If it were me, I'd go for a prebuilt flood with rgb. I don't think you will care if it is white or white once you have them installed. Although now that you have in your mind it should be rgbw, then you might have some buyer's remorse if you only get rbg. But really, the results are not that going to be that different especially because you want warm white. With rbg providing the white, you can adjust it warmer or cooler by yourself. And I bet you put it in "pretty mode" more often than you use white mode (green and gold would look really good ;-) ). And it it were me, I'd look for ws2811 protocol just because that is likely to be the other items in your stockpile. And don't be afraid to put 24v on the floods (if they support it)...you will have less PI.

You can find a rgbw flood from ray wu (aliexpress). https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2255799962813633.html It uses UCS2904 protocol. You might want to make sure your controller or the one you buy has specific support for it. In theory, it is very close to ws2811 and might work but there is thread from 2018 where someone had problems. Here is one from Wally's Lights https://wallyslights.com/collections/flood-lights/products/10-watt-rgbw-12v-flood-light that uses WS2814. Again, check that your controller will work with it.

Speaking of controllers, you might want to investigate WLED. It runs on ESP devices and has an easy way to set patterns and colors during the off season that can work off your phone so you aren't pulling out Vixen or xLights to create a new sequence to run.
 
I don't think I will have buyers remorse. I only spent about $30 for 20 of the rgbw 12w chips. My main desire was not to spend $100s since I need at least 10 floods for my house. That is $170 plus for they Ray wu. But if I don't have a solution for the chips then that is the way I will have to go. I can always experiment with the chips later.
 
If you're already that familiar with DMX, then why not stick with DMX for floods? All things equal, DMX is the better fit for <512 channels. Especially if floods are all you're going to have in the off season. Just throw on a virtual light board, some chases, and you're done
 
Is there some sort of mystique about pixel drivers vs flood drivers?

The problem can be easier to work on if you reduce the concept to its essential parts: there are 4 lights -- they just happen to be 4 colors, RGBW. A pixel driver is essentially nothing but an SSR of a specific type for a specific kind of light. As you have four lights, to control them individually, you need four SSRs.

If you want to be able to control them with a data stream, this becomes nothing other than a four-channel controller. From the very beginning, the concept of making my display has been to use multiple, small-channel-count controllers and use them simultaneously to create the overall show. The first one DIGWDF made was the MiniRen8/4 controller -- a 4-channel controllers for AC lights. Replacing the AC and TRIAC power circuitry with DC circuitry and MOSFETS and you have the DC version, which might be called a "pixel driver." Or, in this case, an RGBW flood driver.

(By the way, Phil's right -- I've got plenty of them in the garage.)
 
This is probably tldr but I am still learning christmas lighting so i am probably still asking dumb questions. I first bought an ESPixelstick and one string of pixels to play with. Once i saw how easy that was i bought a bunch of PixelPops boards and components to build out more controllers. Still in build out for those. But i bought an additional 10 strings of pixels and am starting to plan my show (with the help of the wife and kids). i have always wanted RGBW wall wash on the house anyway. so i decided to try to build out those (to save $$$). But the chips i bought from AliExpress are just RGBW LED chips. No ws281x in them so the PixelPops would need something else in line for the floods. And since the LEDs are 12 watts and the spec says 500ma per channel, i figured i needed something that could do both the pixel control protocol and the pwm at the higher amperage. That was when i looked at RobG's boards. i just didnt notice that they were only RGB and not RGBW. I could build a DMX interface and am looking at that as well. But i would also need a E1.31 to dmx bridge since i intend to run the show using FPP. I have a big yard. so wireless is desired as the cable runs would be long.
I could design DMX and eDMX networks in my sleep. its what i used to do for a living. but then budgets were in the +$300k range for full systems in churches and theatres. So i spec'd high quality gear that was installed by a licensed contractor. Now i am trying to design on a dime and build out myself when i have time. sometimes that makes for stupid decisions. I just forked out $300 for the Ray Wu floods that MikeKrebs suggested. So i will be using those for my wash. The RGBW chips are still coming since i only paid $30 for those. i will find something to use them for. But now i dont have to sweat building something that works by november. i thank everyone for your advise.
 
If the goal is just to have floods working at a residence (and interoperable with pixels), I keep feeling like this is harder than it needs to be. Some pixel controllers drive both DMX and pixels at the same time (ex. kulp4's, two ESPixelsticks), and the sequencing software supports it. Ali sells fixed-head RGBW DMX fixtures for $30. So one configuration, say, is you attach 4 pixel strings to a Kulp4, and you attach a cut-open DMX XLR cable (3-pin) to the DMX port. The XLR connector would probably go to a wireless transmitter ($30).

Now, you go into your sequencing software--Xlights is what I know--and test some effects on your pixels. Then you add some DMX effects for your floods (in Xlights) and have them play at the same time. E1.31 can be nice, but not necessary (although I think ESPixelstick does that under the hood). If your pixels and DMX are playing at the same time, then you are in business.

If you're running just DMX (say, in the off season), you can run Xlights (free) direct to a USB dongle ($16), and use Xscheduler. No controller required.
 
1pet is right in that this is being made harder than it needs to be, partly because everyone is talking at cross-purposes.

Apart from the LEDs, I think that there are basically four parts needed at a minimum. First, enclosures and a way to mount things in them . Secondly, power supplies. Third, cabling (for power at a minimum, possibly for data). Fourth, controllers. I think that it's a bit silly to fuss about one of these four items without considering the other three.

As far as controllers go, if I were in your situation I would look for 'Wemos MOSFET shield', something like this might do the trick, along with a Wemos D1 Mini and perhaps with the WLED program that someone mentioned. But as I mentioned above, everything has to be taken into consideration, not just the controller/driver.

Edit - one thing that is missing from 'this' device are current limit resistors to keep from blowing up the LEDs, but that is easy to handle off-board.
 
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What is the end purpose? To build a new ws281x flood, or just to light up someone's house? Because the former is way overkill just to do the latter. There are lots of DMX floods already. Is there some secret sauce about this one?
 
There is no need to be snarky.

The upside of what I suggested that it's wireless (except for power, of course), and it's closest to being responsive to the original question. The downside (by comparison with COTS DMX flood) is that the question of enclosures is still open. There was no mention about using WS21x in any way, shape or form in my comment, so I'm not sure where you're thinking.

There are obviously trade-offs to be made, it all depends on what they are comfortable with.
 
I remain by my question. Why are you building your own RGB? Any DMX flood can be made immediately wireless by putting a receiver on it. Addressing the original question, you have a theater lighting guy first getting into residential. You don't need a $2000 light board to leverage what you already know about DMX. What's the rationale for DIY'ing your own floods? Cost? Integration with ws281x? The challenge? Hoping to create something new? I'm not sold that building your own floods is even what you want at all. Even if you receive a signal and manage to PWM the 4 channels, do you think you're going to be able to diffuse it as well as a standard 18x18w fixture, in your spare time?
 
P. Short said:
1pet is right in that this is being made harder than it needs to be, partly because everyone is talking at cross-purposes.

Apart from the LEDs, I think that there are basically four parts needed at a minimum. First, enclosures and a way to mount things in them . Secondly, power supplies. Third, cabling (for power at a minimum, possibly for data). Fourth, controllers. I think that it's a bit silly to fuss about one of these four items without considering the other three.

As far as controllers go, if I were in your situation I would look for 'Wemos MOSFET shield', something like this might do the trick, along with a Wemos D1 Mini and perhaps with the WLED program that someone mentioned. But as I mentioned above, everything has to be taken into consideration, not just the controller/driver.

Edit - one thing that is missing from 'this' device are current limit resistors to keep from blowing up the LEDs, but that is easy to handle off-board.
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I like your logic here Phil .

but ,I also like to play !

These are a great fit to have fun with
A
B

and if the OP would like the Ws28xx component they could toss in a few of these

Gotta love diy.............. :)
 
As the OP, Honestly I didn't intend to start a big debate. My original question was for an alternative or mod for RobG's pixelflood board to control 4 colors instead of 3. Yes, I was going cheap. Which is why I bought 20 12w RGBW LEDs for $30 bucks. Yes, I enjoy diy and thought I could keep my cost down. But after all the advise here I decided it wasn't worth the effort and bought some rgbw floods from Ray Wu. At $300 shipped it is probably worth it. The LED chips I bought will go in a box on the bench for future tinkering. Since this thread has gone waaay to far down the rabbit hole I consider my original question answered. Thank you for the lively debate.
 
Razzle69 said:
As the OP, Honestly I didn't intend to start a big debate. My original question was for an alternative or mod for RobG's pixelflood board to control 4 colors instead of 3. Yes, I was going cheap. Which is why I bought 20 12w RGBW LEDs for $30 bucks. Yes, I enjoy diy and thought I could keep my cost down. But after all the advise here I decided it wasn't worth the effort and bought some rgbw floods from Ray Wu. At $300 shipped it is probably worth it. The LED chips I bought will go in a box on the bench for future tinkering. Since this thread has gone waaay to far down the rabbit hole I consider my original question answered. Thank you for the lively debate.
Click to expand...

Don't worry about it. This sort of thing has happened too many times in the past...
 
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