Firegod Flicker is back....

If the field module LED stays on when you disconnect the SSR, then you likely have a solder bridge or other flaw on the board. If the LED goes out when you disconnect the SSR, you might have a bad cable or a short on the SSR board. Does it work right if you switch 2 of the SSR plugs?

The voltage regulator is a 6 volt, like this:
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Fairchild-Semiconductor/KA7806AETU/?qs=PeFKkYunQooOH3A19Q2JfA==

That will help you a lot i think, it helped me resolve a lot of issues with mine, especially if you have long cable runs, cat5 cable runs that are real long will drop a fair amount of voltage and since the FM's are powered by the 5 volts down the wire, longs runs can leave you with 4 or less volts at the field module... the 6 volt reg will help that situation a lot!

-James
 
I am using a 6V regulator, a 2 amp power supply and had to R & R the big cap on the PC interface. 72 hours from a full scale test. I'll report results.

Greg
 
So I have discovered that when I unplug the SSR the LED goes out. Yet switching SSR's makes no difference whatsoever. The same LED remains lit no matter what Vixen says or what SSR module is plugged into that group of 4 channels. The LED is on unless the SSR is completely unplugged. The whole FM seems to be iffy about responding to Vixen so im going to go over it with a fine tooth comb tomorrow. But if anything comes to mind I'm all ears.

Greg- what cap did you replace yours with, and is the 2 amp power supply you are using still a 10v AC like the one spec'd? I ordered the 6V regulators but they have yet to arrive. My cable runs to the FM are very short <25' so I really can't believe that is the problem but my fingers are crossed.

Aaron
 
To follow up- the show is finally opening tonight and most everything appears in order. I am still having some pretty bad flickering through the Firegod but will work with that when the new regulators arrive.

As far as the problem with the channel staying on-
while soldering the pic socket on the FM I made a bad joint which grounded that particular channel- thus locking it on for whatever reason (that will teach me to cheap out and order my PBC's without a soldermask) . With that said the FM appears to be functioning perfectly now.

I would still like to know of any other modifications to reduce the flicker and also what upgraded power supply to go with.

Thanks,

Aaron
 
I would call my issue (which may be resolved . . . still finalizing the FG plan - it's late, I know) as pulsing rather than strobing or flashing. It was that same for all FMs so I figured it was a PC Interface issue. I would not let myself believe that I got bad components so I chased other problems. Visual, pin outs, chasing traces (my board is a REV1) I even got one of Roger's (51fordF2) boards to compare and test. I never got to the point of putting a scope on it (N7XG was going to loan me one) before I started throwing parts at it.

I purchased a transformer:
http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/TX-122/12-V.C.T.-2-AMP-POWER-TRANSFORMER//1.html

Based on David's comments I R & R'd the 2200 uf cap on the PC interface and that's as far as I had to go (I think).

Couldn't help adding to the heat sink - just seemed to run a bit warm.

Good luck,
Greg
 
Update:

At the moment, FG is OPERATIONAL! I'm only using FM3 (13 channels worth) but all seems well.

My son built up 3 Cat 5 cables (PC Interface -> FM), the first two were bad but when I hooked one bad one up, I saw what may be the strobing your talking about. Maybe try to use some commercial cables for a test as the strobing went away with good cables.
 
Geez Greg, I never thought about using a transformer that sat by itself, I was always hunting down 2amp+ walwarts which are super pricey. That setup of yours looks very nice!

I'll have to try that, that's one thing I haven't tried. I kind of suspect it won't solve my problems as some nights I run all night without a single flicker, but worth a try nonetheless!

After the last week and a half of having horrible flicker, I ran Friday night flicker free again. I can't put a finger on it, the ONLY difference I could find that night is that it rained (and the wind blew 75+mph, can't believe the display survived!!) about 2 hours before showtime. The first thought that comes to mind for me is static...but I'm not sure how I'd track that one down.

I still think I am fighting a different problem than you all have as my field modules have NEVER had the flicker on the LED's, they have always been rock solid, only the lights plugged into the SSR's flicker, and at that, not all flicker with the same frequency.

Very glad to hear that your FG is up and running well!! I'm giving the FG's till the end of this season to figure out the flicker, if I can't, i might be building a bunch of Ren's this summer....

-James
 
jcizek said:
Geez Greg, I never thought about using a transformer that sat by itself, I was always hunting down 2amp+ walwarts which are super pricey. That setup of yours looks very nice!
-James
Click to expand...

James - I ran 220 channels on two FG systems last year, without a single hiccup. No flicker or anything. I ended up sending one system to Greg, so he could use it to troubleshoot his system, and see if he had any flickering/pulsing with my system. If I recall, he didn't have any noticeable flickering with it.

I also used separate transformers for each system. When I got my parts in the group buy, one of the wall warts was DOA, and it was replaced. It worked for a while, but got really hot (as hot as the heatsink) and smoked, after probably two hours of use. At that point, I switched to two serious xfmr's from Radio Shack, and used them all season. I ran from Thanksgiving to Jan 7th last year, every night, from 6 pm to 10 during the week, and until midnight on the weekends.

I didn't set up this year - too many "personal" things - but plan to go big next year. I am hoping to use the Helix, as I have 512+ channels of Helix, and own the lot across the street, where my shop is. so I can orchestrate BOTH sides of the road!

I hope you don't give up on the FG - as I said, it was flawless all season. Possibly I can send you one of mine, as well, if you want. PM me. I'm not interested in selling, but might be down the road. But it's nice to have a "back-up" system.

Good luck!

R
 
jcizek said:
Geez Greg, I never thought about using a transformer that sat by itself, I was always hunting down 2amp+ walwarts which are super pricey. That setup of yours looks very nice!
-James
Click to expand...
Thanks for the compliment. The case and install are mine, the idea for the transformer is 51fordf2's!
Thanks Roger.

I wish I could be more effective help with your issue. Keep us posted.

Greg

Update: Running 29 channels on one FM - all is well. Adding 32 channels and a second FM on Thursday.
 
Last edited:
OK, next question... Roger, Greg, STG, are you guys running sourcing or sinking code on your FG's?? Also, what SSR's are you using?

I am still thinking that my problem *may* be SSR related... one thing I have noticed the last few nights while watching more closely, is that NONE of the SSR's I have built THIS year (ie, different batch of parts) is flickering on any night... only the one's i built for last years show (first year doing it). I am wondering (mostly due to discussion in another post about bad triacs) if maybe I am having a problem with a bad run of parts! I haven't had any fail, but it seems odd that only last years SSR's are flickering (including if I switch an SSR from one position to the other, putting a "new" ssr in seems to solve the flicker)

Also, can you guys tell me what Triacs you are using in your SSR's?

Thanks!! I don't really want to ditch the FG, just once in a while seems like I run out of ideas on what to check next!!

-James
 
James,

I totally can relate to your frustration - don't lose faith.

I'm using sinking code, FM address hard coded in the chip, no jumpers.

At the moment, I'm using home etched SSRneons but will add today, 8 SSREZs. I'll run those tonight and hopefully have good results (pulsing wise).

I will edit this post later today with part numbers.

Greg
 
Well, I grabbed a couple of 3 Aamp transformers yesterday, got home, wired them all up and got ready to install them, by that time the show had started and as I went outside, noticed I had NO flicker at all, all night! So I left it alone for last night, but have the transformers sitting here ready to go for tonight. We'll see if that makes a difference! Figures that soon as I have them ready to go, the show runs smooth :)

Will report back after tonight's run! -james
 
Good news, perplexing, but good news. It's REALLY difficult to nail down intermittent issues - as you know - but were all rooting for you!!!

Greg
 
Well, I installed the new 3amp transformers today. Had some hope that it might help, but it did exact nothing. Flicker is *really* bad tonight, so went out and switched to the new transformers mid-show... didn't solve a thing. Flicker is just as wicked as it was with the walwarts...

I think my next step is to build a sort of tester. I think build a board with a PIC that doesn't take any serial input, just constantly outputs a fixed timing pulse after the zero cross (for example, it just constantly always outputs a "50% dim" signal ) that I can plug the SSR into instead right at the field module. Basically a replacement basic field module. It will need to have the ability to power from the PC module, OR provide it's own power and ZC signals (to isolate further that the problem isn't coming from the ZC or power from the PC module) Hopefully I will have time to build one tomorrow and test. More to come... -James

-James
 
OK, as you may have read over in the SSR forum, i'm back to thinking this is an FG problem after all and not an SSR problem.

One question, do any of you that have used the FG in your display have any video? I'd love to see what the dimming looks like on someone's FG that is working properly! Thanks. -James
 
James,

I posted in the other thread about your dimming comment - I think. New board format.

Anywho, I'm digging out the FG interface and FM4 from storage to try and shoot some video for you today. I'll be using a still camera with video mode - it's all I have to use. I hope the quality of video will be enough to help.

PM me your email address and I'll fling you video that way.

Greg

Update. Have some video and some stills. Searching for the cable to download. I really need to clean up all the work areas.

Update. Ready to email. marshall@canby.com

Update: Emails sent - good luck!
 
Last edited:
Video of this years display. My biggest problem was some of the LED sets would dim at certain voltages and others would dim at different voltages... they would even do this if they were plugged end to end. So take that into account while watching

http://vimeo.com/18431274
 
Is anyone running Firegod this year? I have 7 field modules out for this year's show mixed in with several Renards. I am still having the flicker but it's no where near as bad this year. I now have a storage o-scope and have built a break out box I can connect in line with any of the RJ45's in the system to measure the signals. I haven't had the opportunity to do this yet between the subzero weather and some family issues but hope that this weekend will present the chance.

I noticed something this year that I don't think I have not given any consideration for... wondering if this will spark any ideas... the flicker only happens when dimming , not when already dimmed (ie, if everything is at 50%, then things are solid, but if I have a large number of channels moving from say 100% to 50% they all flicker randomly) Also, I noticed that if only a few channel are dimming at the time, no flicker, it only happen when large amounts of channels are doing dimming. For example, in a sequence where each of 20 minitrees are being light and dimmed one at a time (or sometimes 2 at a time) no flicker, but dim all 10 or all 20 at a time and not only do those channels flicker, but so do many other channels on different field modules!! It's almost like it's still an inadequate power issue (though I have moved to very large transformers for the PC module power now,... i think they are 4 amp transformers)

Anyway, I hope to have more info this weekend, but wanted to toss that new info out and see how everyone else using FG is doing this year!
Thanks! -James
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top