Resurrecting this post (hope that's ok).
Are there any recommended parts and places to source parts for both AC and DC fuses, fuse-blocks, etc.?
For DC, I was going to use in-line ATO fuses (
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008CVPE8C?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00) where appropriate but didn't know what to use on the AC side. Amazon had some options but they were questionably expensive so I assume I can save some dough but going through a place like Mouser.
I actually like the ATO style fuses but those are DC only right? For AC I need to use the glass tubes?
Basically my plan was for my Renard TR16 setup, not worry about it since it already has AC glass fuses on both sides.
For DC, I was going to do something like:
AC -> AC Fuse -> DC PSU -> DC Fuse -> Controller
Since the E1.31 already has fuses on the DC side, I was thinking of just adding an AC fuse there. But my Ren4floods have none of that. I figure at minimum to use the above idea, but wasn't sure if each channel output also needed a fuse? I wasn't going to worry about that for my flood lights as the LEDs and boards are all contained in the same enclosure, but I will be using ren4floods for some coro trees.
Also good places to source glass tube an ATO fuses? Just the local hardware store and auto parts stores?
Hello folks,
I might be able to shed some light on this fuse situation. I've spent 30+ years as an electrician. Here's what the National Electrical Code has to say in regards to fuse type. Use a fuse that is rated for the VOLTAGE you are using. I.E. NO, don't use 36v automotive fuses for 120v AC. YES, you CAN use GLASS fuses rated for high voltage on LOW voltage.
Most AGC style "glass" fuses are rated up to 250v and probably the MOST common fuse and least expensive. Slo-blow vs. fast-blow. Hmmmm ... no, only use FAST BLOW. Slo-blow fuses are used to absorb some current inrush and generally are on motors which require that little bit of extra to get spinning. Fast blow fuses for everything else and they are usually cheaper too.
Hundreds of control panels I've worked on, later, it's the same. Current is a consistent factor based on voltage. Ohms Law. Fuses are rated for amperage and MAXIMUM operating voltage. Low voltage is less than 50v - High voltage is greater than 50v (doesn't count the overhead power lines from 7.2 to 34.5kv - some of us call it DEAD voltage if it ever bites you).
Regarding SIZE of fuse. The NEC is clear you want to protect the wire size you are using. Over current devices protect the wire. NEC Article 310, NEC Table 310.16 is pretty clear on this subject. Overloaded conductors are the primary cause of fires and failure. What you will not see are the smaller wires under #18 ... there are other tables in my trade that allow for over loading conductors in control cabinets ONLY. Go figure. Seasoned electricians don't do that.
Here's a good table, pretty clear too:
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/wire-gauges-d_419.html
This is an example.
If you want to protect the LIGHT or DEVICE you are using, there are several ways using OHM's Law to determine what sort of current interruption you need. Want to protect a 100w lamp at 120v? 1A fuse because 1a x 120v = 120w (there are allowances up to 125%) ... lamp goes bad or breaks? either the fuse remains intact (bad lamp) or opens because the lamp shorted out.
Dr. Neutron:
I noticed in the picture all that tape around the connection. I would only wonder how long it had been taped? Done for waterproofing? Moisture will get under the tape, corrodes the contacts - the contacts create resistance - the resistance causes heating - eventually the contacts fail. The photo tells me that damage was mostly from overheating caused by trapped moisture corroding the contacts. Rope light, 2 little pins and a nut? The tape covered up the pending failure. The first clue was the tripped GFCI - Good man! U used the safety tools!
This brings me to the next important point.
INSPECT all wires, connections and cords for damage BEFORE you use them. Those wires have been sitting around for awhile ... maybe they are getting old ... brittle? Maybe you missed it last year and have a bare conductor now. Visually inspect for DISCOLORATION around sockets and plugs. If they show any sign of brown and/or cracking (sunlight fading doesn't count) it usually means it is time to either repair or retire that unit.
Many years doing seasonal lighting and I've never taped light connections and when I do, I use rubber tape or a high quality tape such as 3M #33 or #88 tape. I take them apart (when necessary or possible) after the season so the connectors can dry out naturally. This also ensures you EXERCISE the connector. It rubs together and can provide a better connection in spite of its age. My oldest trick (wd-40) using NEWLY available materials to keep connections in good condition is to use silicon gel. Available at your local auto parts store as "SPARK PLUG BOOT GREASE" Get a BIG tube - it's cheap enough. It doesn't conduct, allows for proper contact and helps displace moisture and adds water resistance to the metal contact surfaces to retard any oxidation or corrosion. It does not interact with plastics like petroleum products.
Not so much with your AC power plugs and sockets but for things like low voltage and rope light or any other small pinned connection.
It has also helped some of these cheap barrel connectors slide together easier. Keep a rag with you - first time around can get messy on the fingers.
Vampire Plugs and Sockets: Silicon GEL or Silicon caulk of which some of us prefer the ladder. Either one is messy but caulk can help add some strain relief and keep those little teeth dry and healthy for years to come. We apply a liberal amount in the wire channel and then mash it onto the wire, slide the cover on and POOF! Pretty well protected plug or socket.
Bit of information: less than 5 MILLIAMPS at 120v can kill you. That's 0.005 amps. Screw the fuse - it'll be happy to keep frying you.
If I had a choice between 120v and 240v ... I rather grab a 240v wire first. 120v sort of grabs you ... 240v will throw you.
ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS use Ground Fault protection! There are people in their graves who wish they did.
Moved into a new home? Older home? No visible signs of GFCI outlets for outdoors? TWO ways to do it. Call an electrician to install the proper device. Buy a GFCI protected outlet. We use these on job sites. It is a cord to a GFCI outlet. Plug in the outlet and then plug in your cords. In the weather? Think "Constant Use" cover for your outlets. My outlets are outside however none are directly exposed to the elements. I can use a GFCI outlet and simple snap covers (spring loaded door).
TEST your GFCI outlet(s) and/or BREAKERS - if in doubt, call your local electrician for an evaluation. I use 2 pole GFCI breakers and they are tested October and December (my GFCI tester is a hospital grade service device). GFCI testers WORK and are available in most electrical departments. If you have a GFCI breaker protecting the outdoor outlet, get a GFCI tester and test AT THE OUTLET . This verifies your wiring also (a bonus tip).
Mixing of wires. Low voltage and high voltage don't play nice together. I read where someone used regular 120v NEMA 5-15 plugs and sockets on LOW VOLTAGE LED strips – yup, crossed the wires and all his strips glowed “RED” for about 10 seconds along with some hideous sounds of bacon frying. There went about $1000 UP IN SMOKE … if I recall correctly. $50 in the right parts = $1000+ in savings – not a bad investment idea.
Don’t go on the cheap – don’t get impatient. Get the right stuff and do it right – it is allot less expensive in the end.
Most wire insulation today is rated at >300v. This is good. Cat5? READ THE JACKET. CL1 or CL2 means >300v insulation and good for IN-WALL use. If in doubt, keep them separated. At the very least ... keep low voltage connections away from high voltage connections - this can help prevent a bad ground loop from frying your electronics. The smallest AC power leak could be just low enough to NOT TRIP the Ground Fault protection – 1 or 2 milliamps is enough to fry electronics. Connector distance is key to help minimize this potential. Don’t go bundling up 120v connections (plugs/sockets) with low voltage jacks and connectors – if exposed to water, that can be a recipe for disaster.
GENERALLY ... crossing low and high voltage cables is OK ... and I mean crossing as in an "X" sort of way. This reduces coupling EMI or RFI - not a terrible thing if they do have to run parallel ... space them if practical. DMX is RS-485 and actually used in industrial automation as Profibus or Modbus or just RS-485. Ethernet cable usually doesn't suffer any cross talk either. There are always exceptions for noise - nothing a homeowner would ever encounter. Like a 4000hp 5kv motor - that sort of extreme stuff.
HEAT SHRINK: It's really good stuff. One point. If it is going to be used to waterproof something, use the DOUBLE WALL shrink tube. It has a glue inside the tube which bonds to the wire(s) ... get it good and warm ... it oozes a bit ... then (with a glove) before it cools, gently press it around the wire(s). This method is used and approved for underground direct burial cable repairs. It works wonders for keeping connections secure and highly moisture resistant. There is also another benefit. Double wall shrinks to ONE THIRD its original size. Single wall only reduces to ONE HALF its original size and is NOT waterproof. I pay about $1 more for double wall – and it is worth every penny having that peace of mind. Hey – it also comes in COLORS including CLEAR!
Want to cap some wires? Use double wall shrink tubing! Cut the piece about 40-50mm … let the end hang over the end of the wire(s) about 15-20mm … heat it up properly and while it is still hot, use a pair of pliers to seal the end. Shazam! Water proofed and insulated end. MOST heat shrink tubing has an insulation rating of 250v or higher. When doing multiple wires in one piece, cut one wire just about 5-10mm shorter than the other to avoid potential shorting. Multiple wires: Stagger them and use a length of tubing to cover them all and leave enough to squeeze it closed. It would be inadvisable to bundle more than 3 conductors.
I hope your head isn’t swimming with OH GAWD or WELCOME TO MARS or worse A DEER STARING IN THE HEADLIGHTS. Given the right circumstances, low voltage can be just as dangerous as high voltage.
Protect you and yours with the power of KNOWLEDGE.
Thanks for your time and I hope someone finds this information useful.
I’ve powered over 10kw of lighting at my own home.
This is how I’ve done holiday lighting for years without any problems.
Make it BEAUTIFUL! Make it safe!
Happy Holidays!
Eddie
